First Kisses, Saving Lives and Our Deepest Fears
Everyone has those stories. The ones that shaped us, scarred us, or made us laugh until we cried (and maybe peed a little bit). Today's episode strips away the serious topics to reveal the raw, ridiculous, and sometimes embarrassing moments that made Nicole and Jolene who they are. From childhood dreams of stardom to saving lives - these are the stories you’ve never heard.
The Firsts That Left Their Mark
Ten years old, on the neighbourhood sidewalk, wondering if this awkward moment counts as a first kiss. That's where Nicole's story begins. Meanwhile, Jolene was busy channelling her inner Sandy from Grease, performing for an audience of stuffed animals and dreaming of Hollywood stardom. Some dreams fade, but those childhood memories have shaped Nicole and Jolene into who they are now.
Sisters, Survivors, and Showing Of
Being a little sister comes with an unwritten rulebook. For Jolene, it meant trusting her older sister when sometimes she shouldn’t have. Nicole's lifeguard years taught her that sometimes the parents needed more watching than the kids. Different paths, same lesson: responsibility comes with a side of chaos.
Family Recipes and Silent Prayers
Some memories taste like lemon bars. Nicole's mother's recipe wasn't just about dessert - it was about love wrapped in powdered sugar. For Jolene, finding peace meant folded hands and quiet moments, letting faith guide her through life's storms.
The Things That Drive Us Crazy
Both Jolene and Nicole had gripes to share when it comes to their husbands, which is always good for a laugh. Whether it is Jolene's husband's loud chewing gum sound that could probably be heard from space, or Josh’s favourite corner of the kitchen when Nicole loses her temper. These aren't just pet peeves; they're the tiny irritations that make relationships real. The small stuff that drives us crazy but makes us human.
Life isn't built on the big moments that make headlines. It's crafted in first kisses behind school buildings, in mother's lemon bars cooling on kitchen counters, in sisters pushing boundaries, and in prayers whispered in quiet rooms. These are the stories that shape us - the ones that don't make it to social media, the ones we rarely share in serious conversations about politics or world events.
Today's reminder? Behind every heated debate, every strong opinion, every firm stance, there's a person shaped by their own collection of firsts, fears, and family recipes. Maybe that's the secret to having hard conversations in 2025 - remembering that we're all just grown-up versions of kids who once dreamed of Hollywood, saved lives at local pools, and believed in the magic of ruby slippers.
P.S. Would you give up the internet for a lifetime of comfort? Jolene's answer might surprise you... 😉
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Nicole: [00:00:00] today we wanna do something different, and have something not about politics today. We have written 10 questions each, we don't know what they are, would you like to start?
Jolene: Well, I do wanna start by saying that, I feel like people are getting, reignited with anger
Nicole: people are so eager to get after each other
Jolene: On both sides right now. And so I feel like maybe we just need to take a little step and say, you know what, let's talk about something that's not politics for a minute and realize that there's a bigger world out there that we are, you know, fundamentally we're going to agree on things that really matter.
And all the other stuff is just stuff.
Nicole: I hear you. I'm so glad you shared that today because I've been feeling it too.
Jolene: I feel like one of the things that I've gotten from people who have listened or watched our [00:01:00] podcast up to this point is we are talking about the same things that others are talking about, but not to each other.
And a comment that someone made was, I was waiting for either one of you to pounce on the other person and go, what? And get mad. But you handled it so well. You both are, listening to each other and then responding. And that concept unfortunately is not, what the rest of us are hearing,
Nicole: we have at this point been societally trained to the gotcha moment.
Jolene: Yep.
Nicole: The attack.
Okay. So would you like to start in this, questioning
Jolene: Yes.
Nicole:
Jolene: What was your first kiss?
I was 10 years old. Courtney Tao asked me which I said to my mom, Courtney Tao asked me to go, and she goes, go where? And I was like. Go mom, and she goes, [00:02:00] go steady. And I go, no, mom, go. He asked me to go and really, he didn't ask me to go. His little sister asked me to go
For him.
Nicole: just sort of stood there and then. I think he kissed me. I know that's kind of a lame answer, but it was, there was a lot going on. was pretty young. And that was it.
there was like a
Jolene: Like, was it in a basement? Was it like,
Nicole: no, it was outside.
Jolene: okay.
Nicole: the street.
Jolene: Okay.
Nicole: same neighborhood.
Jolene: Okay.
Nicole: it's not the most exciting answer.
Jolene: what was the first thing you wanted to be when you grew up?
an actress.
Nicole: You did
Jolene: Yep. I totally always thought I was gonna be an actress. And isn't that funny because I think that's what I met you. So it's what I always wanted to be growing up, but I [00:03:00] didn't like, I can remember like performing in front of, in the living room in front of my parents and their friends, and I would like, I'd put on like the, Grease album, and I would sing the songs into a microphone and I would act, and I, I just, I always wanted to be an actress. You don't say actress anymore though. You say actor, don't you? You can't say actress.
Nicole: You can say whatever you want.
Jolene: Well, I thought I wanted to be an actress. I don't know. I remember my dad or my mom, either one of them going, yeah, you're not gonna make a living at that. Like if you wanna go be in the community theater after your accounting job during the day, then that's okay, but you are not going to be an actress.
And then when I met you and I'm like, hells bells look. Look at that. You can be an actress. She's gonna do it. She's going to college to be an actor. Why can't I. By that time, no, I [00:04:00] couldn't. So did
you ever think
Nicole: about switching to be a theater major?
Jolene: oh my gosh.
Or
Nicole: would your parents have just
Jolene: Oh yeah, no.go get your degree where you can make some money and you know that you're gonna make money, and then you can pursue that if you are talented enough.
Nicole: And you were a pharmacy major?
Jolene: Yeah, but then I couldn't pass calculus to save my life. Like I took it three times and I finally went, just gimme the damn D and let me move on.
I will, I'll, I'll change my major. Just give me the D. And so then I turned to speech and hearing science with a business minor. because then at that point I knew I wanted to go into medical sales. So.
Nicole: Did you have a job in high school?
Jolene: If so, what was it?
Nicole: yes. I was a lifeguard.
I was a swimmer from kindergarten through 18. and so I was on the swim team and I played water polo, but i was a [00:05:00] lifeguard. at A pool, not an ocean. They are so badass.
I was a lifeguard at a country club. will say that. I have a memory they definitely weren't following the rules, the owners, because I was the only lifeguard on duty. I never got substituted out.
Jolene: Oh.
Nicole: is not, you're not supposed to ever do that. And one, day there was a company picnic and there were hundreds of people with with their children. And I'm 17 years old and i was the guard. on duty for this party. what people don't know, y'all is hot tubs are dangerous, and if you have a hot tub, make sure you don't have the children in the hot tub. what was happening is these people were drinking. I saved five children out of a hot tub that day.
Jolene: No.
Nicole: Swear.
Jolene: Wait, what do you mean? Saved them out of a hot tub? Like they got, they went under [00:06:00] hot.
Nicole: yeah. And they,
and they went under and the parents are drinking and not paying any attention, and I pull 'em out of there it was a
crazy time
Jolene: Wow.
I worked at a nursing home and I worked in the kitchen. It was the best job, I would go after school and, help the cook. she did all the cooking and then I would serve the meals to the patients and then clean up and go home. It was great.
Nicole: that's amazing.
Jolene: I love old people there were some mean old men sometimes, and mean little old ladies. But for the most part, they were so cute. So like when we went to prom, I came with my date and they would put all of the patients that wanted to, they'd put 'em out in the main living area.
And so I'd come, I would show with my date, and they'dlike to see us in the dress and they'd touch the dress. It was so, it was the best. It was so cool. Yeah.
Nicole: it's your turn.
Who was your first friend and what games did you like to play?
Jolene: it was [00:07:00] probably Marty Malo. He lived across the street I think it was always neighborhood kids, because then when we moved from Ankeny, then we moved to Pleasantville, and I would always hang out with Steve Marsh
He was across the street, and we would ride skateboards together. I mean, it was just whoever was in the neighborhood, it was the,
Nicole: was what you did.
Jolene: yes. Yep.
Nicole: I don't wanna see you till dinner.
Jolene: Yep, that's exactly right.
Nicole: Those were the days.
Jolene: my question was, what did you wanna be when you grew up?
Nicole: an actor, would
Jolene: You always did.
Nicole: Yeah, when I was six years old, I wanted to be an artist, and then Cassie McCord, drew better than I did. So I was like, well, if Cassie's gonna be better at me as a, I can't be an artist then
Jolene: I'm not gonna do it.
Nicole: if I'm not the best, I'm not gonna direct.
So yeah, that was truly it. We were, oh my gosh, we, I had the most amazing first grade teacher. [00:08:00] her name was Mrs. Stark. she was so inventive She would teach science, she would leave the room and then come back in this lab coat with glasses and she
Jolene: Oh,
Nicole: Stark Parkell. And she would teach us science, like
Jolene: oh.
Nicole: was amazing. She also taught us, which now they would never in a gazillion years let her teach it, but it was so fundamental to my core. So six years old, first grade, she taught us about King Henry vii and his wives and how she, how he killed the wives. Yeah.
Jolene: Oh wow.
Nicole: when I'm telling you thatwe drew pictures of King Henry vii and his wives, but Cassie's was better than mine. That's what I remember. Not so much that he killed his wives,
Jolene: who was your first celebrity crush?
Probably Farrah Faucet. I just had a huge crush on her because she was beautiful. And Charlie's Angels. Yes. And I loved Charlie's Angels.
Nicole: Okay. Were you allowed to watch it? Because I [00:09:00] wasn't.
Jolene: I could watch Charlie's Angels 'cause it was on Wednesdays at eight o'clock. I can still tell you it was on Wednesdays at eight o'clock. I don't even know if that's right, but I think Me too.
Nicole: Loved,
Jolene: mom wouldn't let us watch, soap.
Nicole: no.
Jolene: couldn't watch Saturday Night Live.
Nicole: No.
Jolene: everything else was network.
Nicole: family down the street whose parents would, tape it with the VHS player
Jolene: Yeah.
Nicole: tape Saturday Night Live and then we'd sneak and watch
Jolene: Yeah.
Nicole: the day.It was so grown up. We were like, what is this magical show?
Jolene: Oh my gosh.
Nicole: did your angel change, like your, like Pharaoh was your first, but did you, because I watched also Charlie's Angels later, like they did reruns when we were like teenagers.
And I'm like,
Jolene: Uh,
Nicole: actually beautiful, and she solves all of the crimes.
They were like role models.
Jolene: what are you most afraid of now?
Nicole: losing people that I love.
Jolene: Mm-hmm.
Nicole: Snakes is a [00:10:00] close second. I do not like a snake.
Jolene: if a snake killed one of your family members, you would be devastated. Yeah.
Nicole: my worst nightmare probably. No, I just, very aware of my mortality and everyone's mortality, in some ways it's great because I really don't take things, for granted.
Jolene: Mm-hmm.
Nicole: a little too sentimental to my people because you just don't know how long you've got here.
Jolene: I would agree with you. I think my greatest fear is losing one of the girls
I know that my mom is going to pass away someday, and I have prepared, you know, I'm good with her. I mean, we're in a good place.
I mean, I know that's gonna happen. My sister, even my husband, like, I know at some point I may have to deal with their, like, you kind of mentally prepare yourself. Like I know at some point I may have to face losing them, but if you lose a child, like that's [00:11:00] not. That's not in the natural order of things.
And so I've never been able to like think about that or process that or prepare myself because I hope I don't ever, 'cause I don't, I don't know if I could.
Nicole: hope that doesn't happen either.
Jolene: Yeah. Well,
What is the one thing that bugs you most about your husband? What's the one thing that he does that just irritates the hell outta you? I,
Nicole: trying to get me into trouble? You first asked me about the first kiss.
Jolene: And now you're gonna ask me about what he, what bugs me about him.
Nicole: well, he knows this when we get in a fight, I know this is not gonna be surprising at all. I'm the yeller he's the powder
Jolene: Oh.
Nicole: and he loves. A corner of a kitchen, give the guy a corner of a kitchen. And he loves to, he's like, this is my safe space. And he
Jolene: That's where he is gonna be.
Nicole: and he is like, I'm not talking to you. [00:12:00] I'm not talking to you like this. Which makes me even more angry because I know he is right, but it just makes me more
Jolene: Oh wait, he's not right every time.
Nicole: No, I know he is right I get mad like
Jolene: Oh, got you.
Nicole: That's what I mean.
Jolene: Oh,
Nicole: he's he's not right.
Jolene: oh, okay. Okay.
Nicole: but,
Jolene: just wanna make sure.
Nicole: like
Jolene: Yeah.
Nicole: Yeah. When I get angry, it's not cute at all.
And he's like, I'm not dealing with your nonsense, Nicole. Which just makes me really
Jolene: Ah,
Nicole: Oh, okay. What is, what about Jeff? What about Jeff?
Jolene: chewing his gum. He's the worst. Like he could, he could literally be a mile away right now. And if he's chewing gum, I'm gonna hear it. 'cause I mean he pops it.
Nicole: isn't like a coach, like they all have that,
Jolene: Yeah, that I mean that.
Nicole: cud like little, like, like
Jolene: Yes, yes. [00:13:00] Oh my God. That's what it is. It's so, and I mean, I can hear it through walls and I'm like, how in the hell do you do that? So loud.
and if he does it in the car, oh, for the love of Pete, and I'll go. Is that gum good? And I mean, now he'll know. Like, that's why I'm asking. And he'll go, why am I chewing it too loud? And I go just like, can you just chew it with your mouth closed?
I, I don't understand how you can make it that loud. Like I don't,
Nicole: Oh God. yeah.
Yeah, I hear you. I hear you. Okay.
Jolene: Yeah.
Nicole: is your walkup song?
Jolene: I mean the obvious, the answer would be Jolene by Dolly Parton.
It might be Toby Keith. we'll put a boot in your ass. It's the American Way, uncle Sam.
Nicole: you mentioned this song
Jolene: I love that song. He wrote it after nine 11. [00:14:00] And if it just doesn't get you fired up to be an American, I don't know what it, what does?
Nicole: I guess I'm gonna have to listen to this song.
that question was, a direct Josh question because summer of cancer,
Jolene: Yes.
Nicole: he had to get a port put in, which was another surgery. every time he would meet a new doctor, the first thing he would ask them is, what's your walk-up song?
Jolene: Really?
Nicole: And it immediatelythe doctor. Warmed them up
Jolene: Oh.
Nicole: it was. So, I mean, considering how much stress he could have been under, he really. never seen someone with such grace under those kind of circumstances, and he connect with these doctors and nurses in a way. I've never, I've never seen it. he taught me so much about what it means to be a good human in
Jolene: Oh, I love [00:15:00] that.
Nicole: they would sort of like warm up and all of a sudden it was like, Oh. wait, I don't know what my walkup song is. And when he did the port surgery, I, I walked in. At the beginning, but, and then they let, had me leave of course, but I was there when he asked the surgeon he just, his face lit up and he
Jolene: Oh.
Nicole: his phone to play it for him. So it was things like that, that you're like, you know, you can be in a situation that just seems so horrible possibly horrible, and he made it this like moment of human connection.
Jolene: Oh my gosh. That is my favorite story you have ever told about him.
Nicole: Oh,
Jolene: I love that.
I was thinking about that. I was like, what is my walkup song? I'm like, darling Nikki, but that's too dirty. And those conservatives, you will hate me now forever. That I say, darling Nikki, I love me some Prince.
I love Prince. Oh, I [00:16:00] loved Prince.
Nicole: all the Prince
Jolene:
Nicole: but I also listen, is it called Bananas? The Gwen Stefani song. That song.
Jolene: B-A-N-A-N-A-N-A-N-A-S.
Nicole: song.
Jolene: it's fun and sort of like
Yeah.
Nicole: power and I
Jolene: Okay.
Nicole: and yeah,
Jolene:
Nicole: All right. Here's one.
Jolene: okay.
Nicole: When you are feeling low, what gives you hope?
Jolene: Prayer. I think That is the one thing that I think has, as I look back through my life and then married life and motherhood and now career, I pray and I pray constantly throughout the day, that God makes his path very clear to me. And so I know that if something. Happens that, okay, that was supposed to happen.
and that I have to trust that God has put me where I'm I am meant to be. [00:17:00] So, I think even when bad things happen, I think, okay, this is all part of the plan.
Nicole: Have you always felt that way, or is it since you converted to Catholicism?
Jolene: I've grown so much more in my faith as I've gotten older. But, um, I mean now where I'm doing a Bible study, I've never done like an intense Bible study. Now I'm doing that. I think, it's something that continues to grow for sure.
Nicole: Nice.
Jolene: What is, what was the favorite thing that your mother made for you? What was your favorite meal that your mother would make for you,\
Nicole: lemon bars.
Jolene: Oh.
Nicole: My mom was an incredible cook. And I would say she was an amazing baker as well, but she, loved her brisket that she would make on Christmas. and my mom away in 2017 we'd been waiting for it for [00:18:00] years and then it was, when it happened, it was totally surprising. and I didn't know what to do. I didn't know how. To grieve. I didn't know, I, I didn't know what to do. And I knew that she loved food and she, she had passed her recipes to me and to my brother. And so the only thing I really knew how to do, Was, I guess it was about month after she died. we had a dinner we had all the people that had sort of supported me around the table made some beautiful food and then I made her lemon bars.
Jolene: Oh. I love that
Nicole: I remember making it and then as soon as it was done and I tasted it, I started to cry. 'cause it was
Jolene: Oh
Nicole: totally reminded me like, [00:19:00] Oh
this is, this is her.
Jolene: You have much more sentimental memories and questions that I did
Nicole:
Jolene: you,
Nicole: no, no, no,
Jolene: you're a very deep thinker.
Nicole: that's why I chose what I chose as a, as as a profession,so I could work that shit out. 'cause that's how I think. What is that your favorite characteristic about yourself?
Jolene: that I don't take things too seriously. I'm very hard to offend. I mean, you could say mean things to me all day and like, I don't care. You know, I mean, I think as long as, as I'm loved and respected by the people that I love and respect, thenI think that's the only thing that matters to me. So I think I'm not easily offended.
Nicole: Well I remember actually when we were talking about doing this podcast and you said that to me, You can say anything. I'm not gonna be offended. And I do love that about you, [00:20:00] and it's so foreign to me. Because
Jolene: don't feel that way?
Nicole: oh my God, I wish I'm a sensitiva. Everything is upsetting..
Jolene: Yes.
Nicole: But again, that's why I chose what I chose as a living. And you chose what You chose. But I do find it. I do. It's to, I'm totally envious of it. I was like, God, I wish I could not care or you don't offend me. I'm getting better,
Jolene: You just seem so confident to me. I mean, you are truly very, very confident I don't know if that then comes through because you've worked at it
Nicole: I mean, thank you. I think there are moments that I feel very confident and there are moments that I don't.
Just, just like everyone,
Jolene: Yeah. Yeah.
if I believe in something I feel very confident because I believe in this and I believe in you, and I believe in our friendship. I feel very confident about this.
Nicole: other things I don't know.
Jolene: [00:21:00] Hmm.
Nicole: depends
Jolene: Yeah,
Nicole: are.
Jolene: that's true. And it depends if you slept last night or not.
Nicole: That's right. Which we didn't sleep very well last night. Neither of
Jolene: Yes.
and you are truly one of the nicest people that I know.
Nicole: Jolene.
Jolene: truly, genuinely nice. Like you are always like, oh, how was your presentation today? Or, I hope your trip went well. And I'm like, how the hell did you even remember that? I mean, like, you are genuinelycourteous and nice and you genuinely want to know about people.
Nicole: I do. I do want to know.
Jolene: I wanna ask you one more.
Nicole: What was your favorite film as a kid? And what is it now?
Jolene: I saw ET probably 22 times. I loved et
Nicole: Mm-hmm.
Jolene: It was funny. It was heartwarming. it was scary. there was just so many themes in that movie that was just, I loved that.
[00:22:00] Um, family Stone.
Nicole: oh,
Jolene: Favorite movie,
Nicole: that movie.
Jolene: The five of us watch it every Christmas.
and we cry
Nicole: the lasagna or something?
Jolene: at the breakfast casserole. Yep. so many parts of that movie. Absolutely. Funny, heartwarming, sad,
this was the first year that we've ever let anyone else watch it with us. Trey Patsy's fiance, watched it with us and I don't know that he appreciated it as much as the rest of us, but it's okay.
what, what were yours?
Nicole: I mean, I loved the Wizard of Oz.
and it scared the shit outta me.
Jolene: Oh Yeah.
Nicole: The witches and the monkeys. Scary, scary, scary. But again, gimme a costume. Those red shoes, stop it with yourself.
And my first play, I think I was five I was toto.
They wrote apart for me and I, and
Jolene: Oh.
Nicole: Who knew that that's would be [00:23:00] the,so Toto had a microphone walking around stage and I was hooked.
Jolene: Of course you did.
Nicole: like, wizard of Oz. And now I don't know if technically this is my favorite now, but there's a movie that I found quite underrated. I'd just gotten out of acting school called Orlando. And Tilda Swinton was the, lead it was based on a Sylvia Plath novel and. The director was this woman, Sally Potter, who she wrote directed it. She composed the music and it just
Jolene: Wow.
Nicole: world. It was so well acted. It was sort of almost time travely.
But you didn't understand that it was time travel as you're watching it. Um, I just, I loved it. I loved that this
Jolene: Hmm.
Nicole: could make. A movie so beautifully all by herself and write musicand Tilda Swinton was [00:24:00] new to us, at least in an American audience. And I was like, who is this magical actor? And yeah. So her
Jolene: Okay. I do have a, would you rather,
Would you rather have a good night's sleep every night for the rest of your life or eat whatever you want and never gain weight?
Nicole: Eat whatever I want and never gain weight.
Jolene: I mean, I was like, I waited 'cause I didn't sleep that well last night. And I'm like, that would be really nice.
I know. That's why I came up with it.
Nicole: so good for you.
Jolene:
Nicole: And actually if you have a good night's sleep every night, your weight is maintained. You know what, can I change my mind?
Jolene: No, 'cause I want you to eat french fries for the rest of your life, and I think that's more important.
Nicole: Oh my Lord. All right, so this is on a similar note. That's funny
Jolene: Okay.
Nicole: Would you rather give up air conditioning and heating for the rest of your life or give up the internet for [00:25:00] the rest of your life?
Jolene: Oh, I would give up the internet in a minute.
I mean, I just think we'd be so much better off.
Nicole: wouldn't it be so fun to have a set of encyclopedias again in your living room?
Remember the microfiche?
Jolene: Oh my gosh, yes. Who doesn't love going to the library and
Nicole: is, just Google it. Use the internet. Google it.
Jolene: All right, my
Yep. Okay, friend. This was fun.
Nicole: Yes. Um, I will see you in a moment.
Jolene: Okay, bye-Bye.
Nicole: bye.
